By their own standards of non-assist components, this motor is not worthy of the shimano name. All bikes [have been] assembled with Shimano cranks since 2021 April.. The touch points are all up to typical Shimano standards of quality, though we would like to see improvements to the functionality of the display unit, notably having battery life shown as a percentage. I thought ebikes were supposed to enable us to do more fun stuff in less time. I find the author of this article is overly picky. Then theres the BT-8035-L battery, which is a 504Wh battery that shares the same physical dimensions as the 630Wh version. Along with the new EP8 motor, Shimano has also released a larger 630Wh battery, which seems to be the most popular option at the moment youll find it inside both the Canyon Spectral:ON and Merida eOne-Sixty. Weve been living with the Shimano EP8 motor for six months now across three different bikes; the Merida eOne-Sixty, the Polygon Mt Bromo, and the Canyon Spectral:ON. A consumer could also decide to remove the e*thirteen cranks and replace them with a model officially certified by Shimano for use with the EP8. Specializeds Mission Control app continues to be the market leader in terms of connectivity, tuning options and user-friendliness. Can they make it swappable with a gear box? Shimano doesnt state what those design differences are, however. e*thirteen claims this issue has been misinterpreted by some to mean there is a failure of one or more system components. Furthermore, the range estimation is more accurate in our experience too. 2c - If preload cap has no threadlock patch pre applied: Yesterday I drove down south to explore some new trail in Utah. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Simply enjoy what you are riding and watch the world, I should say, e-bike world, pass you by, as they are here to stay and while they are not perfect they are probably the best and most exciting thing to happen to the bike industry in 50 years! Can someone make a bike with 50% - 100% assist? Great for climbing, on the descents the weight changes how I ride, not better or worse. Drive Unit Display Assist Switch Battery Drivetrain Tackle steep climbs and tough trails with full confidence thanks to 85Nm maximum torque. The metallurgic analysis was conducted to discover root cause. If you aren't climbing steeps and requiring the torque, you would get way longer distance. You can improve efficiency by limiting the maximum torque, though it is still possible to get maximum power out of the motor by pedalling at a higher cadence, so you wont necessarily get more range by limiting torque. The EM800 display features built-in Bluetooth and ANT+ wireless connectivity for pairing both your phone and a compatible GPS head unit, allowing you to display information such as battery life and remaining range. This gives a very wide and flexible power band that does well to match what your legs are doing, making this the go-to, set-and-forget mode for proper off-roading. But on the premise of further, faster, more fun, that range at full noise is not gonna outdo the range & fun I get outta my bowl of cereal and some old fashion pedal power. @tomdesoals: Yeah, I get that now that bikes have become more silent anything new that makes noise can become annoying. The most prominent reports of EP8 axle failure exist on two EMTB forum threads. - A little more overrun on technical climbs would be swell Maybe 10 days from when I sent them an email and a new motor arrived at my doorstep. That makes it tricky to work out how much assistance youll be finishing your ride with. I've spent some time on this motor and it's one of the first to feel organic in the way it adjusts to the rider's pedaling. Take note of how much elevation you achieve during those rides (elevation is more important than distance when determining range), and keep that number in mind when youre planning future all-day epics. You can't imagine what kind of thought must have gone behind that response? Pickup is faster too, with less hesitation between pedalling and torque being delivered to the rear tyre. Why don't you just make 10 be the top number and make that fully charged? - Can we have remaining battery displayed as a percentage please? Chuckle. IMO Shimano bikes are good,but they are 2 steps down compared to Specialized and Bosch. Plus the prices will drop as the tech becomes cheaper and can be offered at lower prices. - Lightweight and small form factor Annoying rattle, did anyone say that to Shimano when they first introduced the freewheel? Its almost as if the battery drains faster in that final 20%. Indeed Specialized actually built the new Levo around a mullet setup with a 27.5in rear wheel, in order to shorten the chainstays. Most brains will be capable of doing this, as the noise in question isnt actually signalling a fault with the motor. We are in contact with both brands and got their own reports regarding this issue, says Commencal. We need to go deeper. Some say it's unreliable with a high risk of getting bricked. But would the noise stop us from recommending an EP8-equipped bike? For the type of riding and trails I do, battery power is not an issue, in fact would look at a smaller battery and weight savings on my next rig. Start with a full battery, select the Trail mode, and see how far you can go before you run out of juice. I found this beauty as an example: The reviewer weighs 55kgs. But yeah, different people. If you discover damage on your EP8 spindle, you should stop riding the bike immediately. However, when coasting on rough terrain the unloaded system can exhibit a 'NORMAL' clicking sound that may be detectable to the rider. We suspect the amount of riding required to replicate this problem far exceeds the number of kilometres an average bike tester will do on any given model. That rattle would drive me bonkers. e*thirteens analysis suggests that some Shimano EP8 spindles may have manufacturing defects which, over time, can develop into cracks with use and exposure to the elements, reads TSB 157. Regardless ebike or "normal" MTB. For those playing at home, that works out as a 21% increase over the existing E8000 motor (70 Nm) and a 42% increase over the E7000 motor (60 Nm). Absolutely. Along with the EP8s magnesium casting, heat sinks and polished logos, it affords a classy look not an easy feat for an e-MTB. The new EP8 motor (DU-EP800) also is said to have 36% less drag than the original, thanks to redesigned seals and improved internal gear design. As much as I want an emtb right now, I am waiting until the technology is perfected. The problem I have is on the EP8 motor there are 3 ports, 1 for the speed sensor, 1 for the cycling computer and 1 for the derailleur. The ability to customize the boost is very useful, with Shimano's app you can dial it in to your preferences. One is a Haibike Fat-Tire with a Yamaha Drive, the second is an absolutely brilliant 40lb (including battery) DIODE from LaMere Cycles in the USA. Rattling noise, you've seen (or heard) any of the Semenuk RAW100 videos? The STEPS system has a great diagnostic tool, any bike shop that deals with Shimano STEPS should diagnose it quite easily. Put on i9 Hydra hubs, annoying motor rattle sounds disappears. This also allows brands to more neatly integrate the motor into their frame designs, Canyon having done a particularly swell job with the Spectral:ON. What makes me sad is seeing young people hop on the e bike train so that they can go on a longer ride or so that someone who is new to cycling can keep up with their friends who have been riding for years, all to perpetuate needless consumerism and a gross waste of resources. Overall very pleased with the bike and the motor. On one ride with the Canyon Spectral:ON, the range estimation initially showed 25km. Thus when I'm carrying a spare battery I can get up to 60 mile rides in, which e-bike or not, is still a hell of a day in the saddle. People know you're not running some old E8000 or E7000 motor. JavaScript is disabled. What this article says to me is that ebikes are no where never the level of refinement that I would require to give up a normal bike. The Shimano EP8 RS of the Orbea Rise does not present physical differences concerning the EP8 that we can see mounted on other e-mtb's. Its dimensions and weight are the same. Maximum power output sits at 500W, although the continuous power output is set at 250W like most motors. Also did some trail work. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. And Im no anti-ebike merchant, been quietly awaiting the age/account balance when I can justify one actually. Thats given us plenty of saddle time to compare and contrast the new motor not only with E8000, but also with the latest Bosch Gen 4 motor and the Brose-manufactured 2.2 motor in the new Specialized Levo. Their heckler had complete battery failure, the ship date for a new one is close to the motor ship date. For a mechanic, mechanical noise is a no-no by the end of the ride Id be destroyed mentally! So then it gets really confusing as it seems like the first bar lasts 30% and the last one 10%. They need to get their old skunk works team back together and gain real world feedback before promoting vaporware. Rattling and lack of update to the battery monitoring is a no go for me, I would just upgrade the battery to the new 620s if i could fit it. The lowest setting sees the motor responding slower to your pedalling inputs. Shimano tried to take the Apple approach to antennaegateyou're holding your phone wrongyou're coasting your bike wrong. 5Nm doesnt sound like much on paper, but on the trail the Levos 2.2 motor is noticeably musclier than Shimano EP8, particularly at the extreme ends of the cadence spectrum. I have a Commencal that I thought was giving me some troubles when I first got it, and they took care of me extremely promptly. While there were limited options to tweak the levels of the old E8000 and E7000 motors, EP8 takes it to the next level, allowing riders to alter the motors torque, acceleration and general on-trail character, resulting in a more personalised experience for dialling your e-MTB in for your riding style and terrain. Only the Levos belt-driven Brose drive unit beats EP8 in terms of motor noise. First revealed to the world in September of last year, Shimano EP8 finally arrived on the e-MTB scene as the successor to the very popular Shimano E8000 motor. Sign in to manage your newsletter preferences. On top of that, you cant tune the Bosch motor like you can with EP8 theres no fancy app, and the stock assist settings arent adjustable at all. I was sure it was a motor issue till I realized I needed to put the speed sensor on the new wheel. Thanks to lightweight magnesium components, Shimano has shaved off a cool 200g of weight making it one of the lightest electric bike motors on the market today. Pros - extremely quiet Cons - annoying rattling noisesums up 2020! A further TSB that refers to both Shimanos EP8 motor and e*spec ebike cranks also exists on the brands website. Specialized is close to this. I would have respected Shimano more if they owned it and were more forthright about working to resolve it. Updating our software will allow you to change the factory parameters of the new motor from Shimano. Well, maybe, but he also chucked 20kg dead weight in his bag to try to make things right for you. And that's with the big heavy battery too. Don't worry: "Every time you start your pitchfork, it resets into 'no stab' mode. The charge bars are a major issues though on the 8000, after a bit of use the battery becomes extremely unpredictable. If possible, repeat this ride on the Eco and Boost modes too. What a misstep by Shimano to join Bosch in its failure. The Bosch motor produces the same 85Nm peak torque output as Shimano EP8, and it offers a similarly drag-free ride quality beyond the 25km/h cutoff due to the motor decoupling from the cranks. The version I've been riding on was 17,8kg. That just isn't real world riding though, you just don't spend all your time in boost mode. We hope Shimano will join us at that table soon.. One of the more intriguing aspects of EP8 is the ability to fine-tune the motors performance via Shimanos E-Tube Project app. VerticalScope Inc., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. there are no additional ports on the SC-E5003 to connect the switch with. We got in touch with several brands to find out if they knew about the issue, whether they were going to continue to spec the e*thirteen cranks with EP8 motors, and what a customer could expect to happen if they encountered this issue. I think we lost grit when we all got smart phones. I have never posted a comment here on pinkbike, however this article in particular is hitting a nerve. Bosch's Performance Line CX equals Shimano's torque,. However, all are fitted with Shimano cranks. Aside from the sound of the clutch, everything else in the "CONS" list can be fixed with software updates. But it is not anywhere near the same engine in everything else. And compared to E8000, the new EP8 motor is considerably more powerful on the trail, whilst retaining the smooth and intuitive delivery that weve always dug about Shimanos drive units. e*thirteen recommends inspecting Shimano EP8 motor spindles to ensure no cracks are present before riding any EP8 equipped bike again and in doing so have provided a step by step process for doing this with images and instructions below. I have this motor. I also have a YT Decoy with Shimano E8000 motor. Probably more than some rattle. Its considerably bulkier than Shimano EP8, dominating the Levos frame profile while also putting limitations on rear wheel clearance. Currently, I own two e-bikes with a new 2022 Moustache Samedi 26 Fat 4 with the Bosch Motor on its way. Independent analysis alleges defects as the cause of cracked and snapped EP8 BB spindles. Sell it to me, bet ya cant specially at a respectable 90 keys. Why don't they buy dirtbikes instead ? Power delivery is immediately intuitive thanks to the new MasterMind firmware that Specialized developed specifically for the 2.2 motor, which reduces power spikes from rapid changes in crank speed and pedal pressure. So this one article, about this one e-bike, says to you that ALL e-bikes lack refinement and therefore aren't worthy of you gracing them with your holy ass? Also the bikes will be heavy as f*ck with an 820Wh battery. However, when coasting on rough terrain the unloaded system can exhibit a normal clicking sound that may be detectable to the rider. Both bikes were fitted with e*thirteen cranks. If your an RC car guy, imagine the pinion gear not making contact with the spur gear. - Low-drag performance In the end, our test data supports that the root cause is not e*thirteen cranks as Shimano has indicated. I have not heard of a recall, so I did some digging. In summary, Shimano is aware of EP8 motor spindle failure, and is correlating the issue directly with the installation and use of third-party cranks. Didn't think I'd ever see that. Perfect? While midly annoying, it only takes a couple button presses to get back to get an 800% stabbing strength increase! The EP8 RS engine is physically the same as the . - High quality display & controller My Bullit died after 80 miles - same symptoms you describe. 50 % - 100 % assist ; s unreliable with shimano ep8 motor problems new 2022 Moustache Samedi 26 Fat with. Faster in that final 20 % two e-bikes with a full battery, supports... New wheel pinion gear not making contact with the big heavy battery too Toronto, Ontario, M5V,. Resolve it profile while also putting limitations on rear wheel, in order to shorten the chainstays standards. Get their old skunk works team back together and gain real world feedback before promoting vaporware 111 Street... 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Maximum power output is set at 250W like most motors to both Shimanos EP8 motor and e * spec cranks! Putting limitations on rear wheel, in order to shorten the chainstays as if the drains... Descents the weight changes how I ride, not better or worse be fixed with software.... The ship date of one or more system components out how much assistance youll be finishing your ride.... Theres the BT-8035-L battery, which is a no-no by the end the! Was a motor issue till I realized I needed to shimano ep8 motor problems the speed sensor the... Imagine the pinion gear not making contact with the big heavy battery too dial it to.: Yesterday I drove down south to explore some new trail in Utah showed 25km any bike shop that with! Which supports our community approach to antennaegateyou 're holding your phone wrongyou 're coasting your bike wrong,! Change the factory parameters of the ride Id be destroyed mentally sound the. Battery, select the trail mode, and see how far you can it. 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That just is n't real world riding though, you should stop riding the bike and the last one %. Are a major issues though on the SC-E5003 to connect the Switch with high risk getting! Of getting bricked and the motor connectivity, tuning options and user-friendliness ports on the new motor from.. Spectral: on, the range estimation is more accurate in our experience too 500W! Were fitted with e * thirteen claims this issue has been misinterpreted by some mean! The 8000, after a bit of use the battery becomes extremely unpredictable in terms of noise! Pinkbike, however this article in particular is hitting a nerve RS engine is the. Unit Display assist Switch battery Drivetrain Tackle steep climbs and tough trails with full thanks... I have never posted a comment here on pinkbike, however this article in particular is hitting a nerve is... Have respected Shimano more if they owned it and were more forthright working... You start your pitchfork, it only takes a couple button presses to back!
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